Various comments on
After The Rescue:
Greywolf
:Ahhh...
I finally finished reading this. Karmen, my friend, I salute thee!
Folks, this is a huge sprawling monster of a story. It's a space opera, a multi-threaded love story, several sorts of tragedy, a whole series of anthropological and sociological dissertations, a goodly part of a Galactic history, a linguistics text -- cho-ho'eyy'osh, what is it not?
It is not bad, that is what. It is absorbing and multifaceted and I had a helluva lot of fun reading it. The nookie's a bit perfunctory for me butcha know what? I enjoyed the rest of it so damn much I didn't even shiv a git -- and besides, every now and then there's a long, detailed, gorgeously sumptuous naughty bit to rescue ye.
And yes, Spock is an asshole in much of this, and he *is*, sometimes. I mean, what the fuck is this Gol shit all about, anyway, huh? As nifty a way of explaining it as ever there was, this here. And I love the Sa's, and the MageCheqs, and Hobie's trial, and the dancing, and... woo hoo hoo.
*Much* fun, indeed! And I found a new name for myself, in here, and that's cool, it'd been awhile, I was due and then some.
So. If ye haven't reawd this yet, check it out. If ye have the stamina to go thru 73 parts it's well worth yer time. and if not, hochofedra, ye will still be in the ineffable mind of god, as are we all. And that's another good thing I got out of this one, that whole MegeCheq attitude of let be, let be, chill out and it will work out. Good advice for this Wolf.
Greywolf and Moondog say Two Dicks Up for this one folks....
GreywolfdeVulCheq, Wanderer, Drummer, Artist and Writer, who would love to go party with the Sa's sometime, and wishes he were still limber enough to dance like that.
***
Kim Wylie:
So layered, so many threads and plots quivering, so many twists and turns.
How on earth (or, rather, how in the universe) do you keep track of everything? I'm awed.
I loved the way Spock threw McCoy at Kirk, then tuned in through his link in order to be a bit of a voyeur. (It was a rather ironic action of Spock's, considering this earlier scene)
He'd called 'come' at the door signal assuming it was Jim wanting to chat. He was pleased and curious to see Spock. The Vulcan definitely had something on his mind and got right down to it: "It was my understanding that you had no previous sexual experience with men, Doctor." McCoy frowned. 'Is Spock jealous? What a frightening thought.
Another favourite scene was when McCoy wrote out his resignation. Kirk waits anxiously for it. Then, when it arrives, bolts off to McCoy's quarters.
The bedroom convolutions are hot, but this series rises up far higher than a slash fic. The original world that you've created is intricate and believable. Your characters have backgrounds, as well as strengths and vulnerabilities. This universe and these worlds you've created have protocols and history. Past sins come to haunt and every action has a consequence.
Sarek becomes a deeper man, capable of causing pain but also deserving of sympathy. I'm happy you didn't feel the need to make the break-up between him and Amanda too messy. It feels more as though they've outgrown the relationship. His relationship with Maja took me by surprise, despite that they spent an intense amount of time together before it became intimate.
I liked this: "That will not be necessary, Maja," Sarek said, momentarily musing on the concept of prayer. "I do have a question for you, if I may disturb you further." Maja raised his eyebrows in a very good imitation of the Vulcan fashion. "Why did you come find me, heal me and protect me in the prison and here as well?" Maja dropped his Vulcan pose and scratched his nose abstractedly: "It seemed," he said at last, "like a good idea at the time."
Sarek's words from "Journey to Babel" come back to haunt him. <g>
Karmen, your paycheck from Paramount is *very* late.
Kim
*
Hello Karmen,
Normally I send feedback privately, but the list has been so quiet lately that I'd like to send a message to it. And I am late for this too…….with one thing and another, well, please accept my apology.
I finished "After the Rescue", and it's a thoroughly good, romping read. Vast, yet detailed. Humorous, yet the stakes are always high for the characters. It's exceptional.
For list members who haven't yet read it, I'm going to put spoiler space between the above and the rest of my message, because I don't wish to ruin the story for anyone.
This
Spoiler
Space
Is
Dedicated
To The
Sexy
Blue-Eyed
Dr. McCoy
Yummm…..
The story as a whole is incredible, but there are snippets of dialogue that I especially enjoyed.
"Bones," Kirk said thoughtfully, "You've had dozens of women over the past few years, haven't you?"
"Well, yes, a few I suppose. I haven't been counting but...."
"Twenty-seven," Spock said flatly.
"...but twenty-seven sounds about right," McCoy finished nodding at the Vulcan.
Snicker that Spock would have that number so quickly available in his head.
------------------
"She makes a great brunette. Wonder why she's never tried it before," was all Hobie had to say about Amanda's appearance at Maja I's coronation.
I wondered here at this understatement of Hobie's, when he'd been so previously passionate in his dislike of all things involving Spock's family. Is this where he was starting to plan his revenge (the severing between Spock and his bondmate)?
------------------
Maja curled into Sarek's arm. "Thank you for letting me sleep here. Those old men are driving me mad."
"Thank you for sleeping here, Maja, I am enjoying >> the sex and company very much." Sarek listened to Maja laugh for a moment. "What are the Sas doing to you?"
"They make me speak in grammatically correct complete Vulcan sentences." >>
"Madness," Sarek commiserated.
>g<
------------------
Standing next to Tien, Maja stared at the canvas until he felt his inner poise return. He was surprised that seeing Spock enraged him. 'The half breed is so smug. I'd like to take him down a peg,' Maja thought. 'But I guess T'Pring's beaten me to it.' He looked up and found Tien examining him. "What's the problem, little one?" he asked crisply.
"I can't get this tube opened," Tien supplied neatly and handed Maja a tube of paint.
"Here." Maja handed it back, opened, and went to sit with the Vulcans again. 'Round two,' he thought calmly.
Maja's character is full and complex, but the above really caught me.
------------------
"Sarek! What do you want? Do come in. How long has it been?" SerNera called out the kitchen door in Klingonese. "Quite some time," Sarek said, also in Klingonese. Even Vulcans were allowed to be vague in Klingonese.
And another >G<
------------------
When the link between Maja and Sarek was severed, it was compelling writing. And, in part 64, I was almost on top of my monitor, trying to get Spock to tell Kirk about the bond. I was like - will you *listen* to McCoy????
Hobie's trial was engaging, and, after all that, they get him on parking tickets.
------------------
The relationship between Spock, Maja, and Tien totally surprised me. Again, I won't say what it is, for those who haven't yet read "After the Rescue" but who have gone down past the sexy spoiler space. I think this relationship is the kicker, and it made me understand why Hobie was so very angry, and why he was willing to kill the bond in Kirk's head.
"What's wrong with you, MajaYaga?" Jir asked brightly.
"He's had so little happiness," Maja whispered, still gazing at the spot where Spock no longer was. "And now it's all gone." He shook his head sadly. "All gone."
"Yes," Hobie agreed softly. "All gone."
------------------
This story is one of those ones that evolves layer by layer. There are entire chapters of original, intriguing characters (applause!), and everyone and everything is continuously in movement. I also think your Vulcans are half Vulcan/half elf - they're certainly mischievous. They're also rather passionate too, like opera singers in the midst of La Boheme. Ok, your Vulcans are one-third Vulcan, one-third, elf, and one-third singers of arias.
Kim Wylie
*
Hello Karmen,
> Thank you for reading and really reading _After The > Rescue_. This story means a lot to me and it touches me deeply when someone enjoys it. You liked many of may favorite parts of the story, too.
It was amazing fun to read - while I like straightforward stories, I also rather like getting into the vaster ones, that have currents and eddys and lots of things going on. They demand more involvement from the reader.
> I wish I were working on a McCoy story for the BonesLives list. I feel like I'm written out and am trying to get back into the swing of things.
After a story, I find I need a period of recharging. Maybe that's what you're in, a swing-down in the rhythm. Now this is me badgering you <g>, but don't let it last too long. You have talent - and *when* (nudge nudge) you go professional with your own completely original characters and work, I will definitely be at the bookstore to buy.
> Also, I don't seem to be able to write anything without Chekov in it these days. I've read a perfectly nice McCoy/Chekov but I don't know if I could make it work.
I don't know much about Chekov's official history. In the series, he had all that Russian pride and that girl who appeared in "Eden", but there didn't seem to be much more of his background given. In the movies, the poor guy got all the creepy-crawlies and the injuries. Maybe you could give him a past. Perhaps, in his pre-Enterprise days, he met McCoy on a Starbase or another ship, a smaller ship in which they shared quarters? Sorry, I'm rambling.
All the best,
Kim
***
T'Thrill:
THANK YOU! I swear! My eyes only! The links work perfectly! I have scouted every site to read all of the TOS slash I can find. I have always felt (since seeing the originals in the 60's...just a baby you understand) that the special bond between the 3 main characters was something that the show, and then movies, only brushed across. I guess my favorite fanfic's (up until now) have been the "Turning Point" and "Full Circle"...that changed when I started this! What can I say...I likem' long and HOT! (pun intended) I found part one on Deja.com and it led me to your posting history. One of the footnotes states also found at your Tripod site. WAH-LA parts posted through 45! I have been an interloper on the ASCEML postings for a couple of years, but have just recently enrolled through onelist. I have some ideas that would involve new characters and seeing what you have accomplished, maybe I will get the nerve up to post, someday! I'll tell you that my favorite Tallijet so far, is Maja. So much depth! I will let you know more after the weekend! Thanks again! Bat
*
Well, I finished it tonight! WOW! I am now in a very contemplative mood. The descriptive way you write is phenomenal! Your characters are so multi-dementional. The Talljet's are wonderful! Maja reminds me of a young Jim Kirk. Very exceptional, very intellectual, and very attractive sexually but never quite finding and keeping a life partner. You come away from this story realizing that no one, even Spock, is perfect. I guess the one I felt the sorriest for was McCoy. In this story he did truly love Spock. He was the one main ST character that had no control over the events that transpired. I would love to know how, exactly, Kirk came to realize he had made such a mistake. Especially since through the bond, it was McCoy that he was in love with. How did he and McCoy find their way back to "falling into bed occasionally"? After Spock's return, how did he come to trust Spock after Spock not telling him about the bond? It seems that Spock, by not telling him about the bond, did the same thing Maja did by not telling him (Spock) about Tien. Her being human, I was surprised to see how quickly Amanda was able to forgive Sarek for his infidelity. Especially since she had asked him to come back to her and he had refused. I would have loved to have heard the conversation that they had in private! (which I assume happened at the party after the acquittal of Hobie) I wondered if she knew about the "roll in the hay" Sarek had with Hobie at the villa. I will never be able to see Sarek as that dispassionate Vulcan that he has always been portrayed as, again! I guess I just want this to never end. I want the epilog to be another "epic" as this was. I know I will read and reread this many times and find something new with each reading. And, I love the sex scenes! Again, you certainly have a talent for description! My husband has no idea why I have been so "attentive" lately! What he doesn't know..... Congratulations, and Thank You, on a job WELL DONE!
*
Karmen,
I know you have heard this from me before, but I have loved this epic tale! Every time I read it I find something new. I have never read a story as multifaceted as this one and every facet gleams like a diamond! The Talljet's are phenomenal and every time I read the story I seem to relate to a different one, depending on my mood at the moment.
Seeing this side of Sarek absolutely wipes me out! I never gave him much thought before, but since reading this, I now have an entirely different feeling when I see his character. I love Amanda with this kind of strength. I always suspected that she would be an amazing lady, this brought that out.
As for the "regulars" Kirk, Spock, McCoy, Chekov ... what can I say? They are wonderful! The depth of character you have found in each and every one is just beautiful.
And of course, all of the "supporting cast," the multiple locations in the galaxy, the uniqueness of each culture and the idiosyncrasy of each being encountered -- is great, as well. I just have to say, that I admire your creative "juices"! What a multi-dimensional mind you must have to demonstrate this type of inventiveness!
I know you are glad to have it all posted. What a task this has been. But, I could be happy with you making a career from this and have it never end. My hat's off to you!
TThrill
***
Emily:
Karmen,
You are a dangerous person. Couldn't stop last night until I finished. That was about 2:30 a.m. Excellent story. Complex, full of life, emotional, heart-wringing, frustrating, surprising, satisfying. Thank you again for letting me see your "preview" work.
Cheers, Emily
***
Selek:
What a totally enjoyable experience. It was very hard to put down...and >when I did, I almost had to shake my head to get back into this universe....
Your universe was so well developed and very different. That view of Vulcan is very unique and thoroughly enjoyable. Sorry that Sarek had a touch of "human-ness" when he left Amanda...but he went back to her. Loved it and have been singing it's praises to all I talk to . Selek
*
I loved this story!! It was a very interesting look at Vulcans and their culture. A definite keeper...
Selek
***
LLY2:
Loved it, loved it, loved it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This was too good. The only bad thing was it had to come to an end. I have spent the last weeks, daily checking the site to see if the next installment was in, while dreading for the last one to come. It was like the old weekly serials at the movies. And I loved it.
This reminded me of Melrose in Space, and it was too good. I'm glad you discovered the Talljets and the Sas and decided to share them with the world.
I can't wait to see what you come up with next. Maybe you will expand on what happened in the epilogue. That's just a hint.
By the way, did I tell you I loved this. Thank you ever so much for weeks of enjoyment and happy anticipation.
*
I just wanted you to know how much I am enjoying this story. It is too good. It's what I really like in a slash, a story with a plot. Hell it doesn't just have one it has several and each one is better than the next.
I also like the fact I came upon this series before you finished posting all of it. When I first came across it, I was instanly hooked and stayed until one in the morning. Not a good idea, let me tell you. These little snippets are just what I need now. I just started law school and don't have time to stay up till one each night, so a few chapters here and there are right up my alley. Besides it gives me something to look forward too, and I feel I have received a sweet little reward when the next one is posted. Kind of like the prize at the bottom of the cracker jack box.
Please keep up the good work, and know that your efforts are much appreciated.
***
Gayle:
Karmen,
This was very enjoyable. In parts it was confusing... but it could have been the day I was reading it on.... and your look at Vulcan lifestyle was very interesting. I found it very different and I am looking forward to meeting these characters again. Or even looking back and reading more about where they came from.
Thank you for sharing,
Gayle
***
Noémia:
Hello Karmen:
Sorry to answer only now, but I've away in my family home where I don't have net. Thanks a lot for this, because I'm really enjoying this story :) I given up trying to figure it out what's going to happen next, and this is the best compliment I can think of now. And what beautiful characters you have created, I guess that I'm in love with the Taljets :) Thanks very much again, you have earned my eternal devotion :)
Noémia
***
Sigrid the Haughty:
*clapping stamping and whistling* Author, author!!!
Great!!! *SO* great... Funny and sad and GREAT!
But it's over. :-(
Spoilers (sort of)
I love that Spock was a selfish nitwit. You would have thought that his time with Kirk and McCoy would have taught him something, but no...
I loved Hobie's revenge. I kind of wished that Hobie would have found his own true love after all that but, c'est la vie.
Poor Tien! Hooray for the RomChek!
Oh, what else?
At this point, I think I need to go back to the beginning and read the whole thing through again.
Thanks again, Karmen. That was fun and fabulous...
***
G.B.:
Dear KArmen and Company, I loved it! I loved it! I loved it. I've been up for the past three days glued to my computer screen. It was fascinating. The world that you created was convincing and well thought out. Thank you!
G.B.
Karmen's reply to Greywolf:
--- greywolf the wanderer wrote:
> Ahhh...
> > I finally finished reading this. Karmen, my friend, > I salute thee! > Thank you, Greywolf.
> Folks, this is a huge sprawling monster of a story. It's a space opera, a multi-threaded love story, several sorts of tragedy, a whole series of anthropological and sociological dissertations, a goodly part of a Galactic history, a linguistics text -- cho-ho'eyy'osh, what is it not? It is not bad, that is what. It is absorbing and multifaceted and I had a helluva lot of fun reading it. The nookie's a bit perfunctory for me butcha know what? I enjoyed the rest of it so damn much I didn't even shiv a git -- and besides, every now and then there's a long, detailed, gorgeously sumptuous naughty bit to rescue ye. I'm glad to hear that. I'll have to work a little harder. This was my first effort and some of the slash ended up being there just to prove how cool I am. Yeah, right. *Perfunctory* is a kind word. Thanks. I've learned a few things this year.
> And yes, Spock is an asshole in much of this, and he *is*, sometimes. I mean, what the fuck is this Gol shit all about, anyway, huh? As nifty a way of explaining it as ever there was, this here. And I love the Sa's, and the MageCheqs, and Hobie's trial, and the dancing, and... woo hoo hoo. I had some fun there, too. Years ago I found myself wondering just who lost the war of logical aggression and what would they be like?
I've also wondered if there wasn't more flotsam and jetsam in the galaxy than we'd been shown previously; how they live; what they do to survive; how do people who don't fit into the Federation structure carve out lives for themselves; how Klingons colonize planets; how beings fall into, stay in, and fall out of love; the difference between faith and religion; how power structures work; how to live around the dominant social one can never be part of; what Federation jurisprudence on Vulcan might be like; und zo on und zo on. I've always been a loner and therefore an outsider so I've spent some time thinking about how we live and how to live. And that thinking just naturally ended up in ATR.
> *Much* fun, indeed! And I found a new name for myself, in here, and that's cool, it'd been awhile, I was due and then some. So. If ye haven't reawd this yet, check it out. If ye have the stamina to go thru 73 parts it's well worth yer time. and if not, hochofedra, ye will still be in the ineffable mind of god, as are we all. And that's another good thing I got out of this one, that whole MegeCheq attitude of let be, let be, chill out and it will work out. Good advice for this Wolf.
And for me, too, Nolo. When I started this story a year ago October, I was in a terrible time. By the time I finished the first draft of ATR last May, I'd not only outlasted my troubles, I'd found a new medium of expression. I'd also found the net, which turns out to be a support net; Jane Seaton; Scarlet; Skaz; you; jonk; raku; JK; JG; ME; ASCMEL and all the ASCMEL-ites, treksmut in general, a more peaceful mind and a calmer way of looking at scary things like the future. My luck even turned up again. Better living through treksmut indeed. D'ya know on December 12, it will be one year since my first post to ASCMEL? Time flies!
> Greywolf and Moondog say Two Dicks Up for this one folks.... GreywolfdeVulCheq, Wanderer, Drummer, Artist and Writer, who would love to go party with the Sa's sometime, and wishes he were still limber enough to dance like that. We'll have to try it next time we meet. Until then,
Godspeed, NoloFara,
Your Ghia
PS. Thanks, GW, for the opportunity to mention the ATR websites again:
_After the Rescue_ or _How Things Changed Between Spock and McCoy After the Rescue_ has two websites and two formats. You can read it at either my personal page http://karmen_ghia.tripod.com/ or on its own page http://oocities.com/Paris/Villa/4422/ It is on both sites in six parts (prologue and parts I-V) or in the 73 posts that went to the ngs. These pages load fast or slow depending on what's cooking at tripod and geocities so please be patient. Also, please email me at karmen_ghia@yahoo.com if you have any problems with the pages or need ATR emailed directly to you as an attachment. KG
***
From: Ellen Fremedon
To: karmen_ghia@yahoo.com
CC: ASCEML@egroups.com
Subject: FB: ATR, part 2
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 21:46:37 -0400
I think my reading has gotten slightly ahead of the reposts, since I downloaded the whole thing from one of Karmen's many sites. I'll try to avoid spoilers as much as I can.
Wow. Karmen, this is simply amazing. I can hardly wait to see where you'll take the story from here; it's already the most wonderfully elaborate, intricate story I've read in ages. You juggle the huge cast and all their complex interrelations with an ease that puts Dickens to shame. I'm reminded of _A Suitable Boy_, or _Njalssaga_, or _Middlemarch_, only none of those have much in the way of hot m/m/m threesomes :-P~~.
I think the moment where I stepped back from the story enough to really notice what you've accomplished here was the line about Sarek setting pimp fashions on Imk. I laughed out loud, but then I started to think of just how much story underlay that line, and how easily you might have lost my suspension of disbelief at any point building up to it-- but you never did.
The best comparison that springs to mind is a slackrope walker I saw performing in front of the cathedral in Antwerp last month, who did a striptease-- took off his pants while walking a slack rope, and then stood there in his paisley boxers juggling torches. That's you, Karmen, standing there on the rope in your neon-blue and yellow underwear, whirling torches through the air, and making it all look easy, where one false step would have you landing hard on the cobblestones with third-degree burns in unpleasant locations.
Singling out favorite moments in this part is hard-- the whole thing is fabulous-- but a few did stand out. The very beginning, with the cookies!!! Karmen, your Kirk is so completely clueless, but the cluelessness is perfectly in character. It's a particularly Kirkian kind of cluelessness. I love all the references to the ineradicable effects of a Vulcan education (you didn't go to Catholic school by any chance, did you?), and I love, love, LOVE Maja's response to Hobie's "The needs of the many."
And I especially loved
Spoiler Space for the ending of part 2
the Casablanca ending!! I had tears in my eyes.
I am going to be absolutely useless for anything else until I've finished this novel. (Which is rather awkward, considering I've got that 'how to build a web page' workshop tomorrow.)
Ellen
***
To: karmen_ghia@yahoo.com
From: Ellen Fremedon
Subject: After the Rescue
Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2001 01:00:37 -0400
Whew! I just finished ATR. Wow. I am agog.
One of the things that really struck me about ATR is how well you were able to show characters doing stupid or hateful things without losing the reader's sympathy. Spock behaves like a complete asshole for so much of this story, but in an utterly believable, Spockian way. I kept wanting to shake him and tell him what to do, but at the same time I was nodding and saying, yes, that's Spock, that's the Spock I still love even when he is an asshole. Maja's trying to prostitute Hraja to KmordriYhet was callous and horrible, but entirely understandable-- and after the sacrifices Maja has made for his brothers, I could really see that though his eyes, he wasn't asking anything too onerous of his son. Hobie's severing the bond between Kirk and Spock was chilling; but his protectiveness of the people he loves made me like and respect him, even when it drove him to that revenge. And that Maja still loved Spock enough to feel sorry for him... I was in Maja's position; I was angry at Spock and thought he deserved a lot of what he got, but it was still painful to contemplate, and I felt very sorry for him. And on top of that mix of emotions, his last words to Maja before going to Gol still made me laugh out loud.
Many, many other things made me laugh; the Sas' party was just one hilarious scene after another, and I *loved* Farro's acceptance speech. And the Sas' doorman. Actually, your Vulcan worldbuilding was so darned funny so much of the time that I scarcely noticed how much sense it made. Or actually, it was probably funny because it made so much sense. The War of Logical Agression, love it.
And with all the Talljets flipping for Vulcans-- love that phrase-- the family relationships got so complicated I had to start drawing charts. Which I relished, since Old Norse reading group is off for the summer so it's been a while since I've had to do that. In fact, ATR has a lot of the features I enjoy in the sagas-- complicated genealogies informing every decision, where every character is the culmination not only of his life experiences but of his ancestors' lives as well; highly technical courtroom drama, political machinations and piracy twisted together inextricably, a judicious use of repetition and formula where appropriate, and a spare, dry, witty narrative voice, which all but disappears in the most heated moments to let the characters speak for themselves.
Your prose, also, improved noticeably over the course of the novel; much of ATR is written in with the omniscient narrator more present, more of a force in the story, than is fashionable in most modern fiction, but it's a style that you do extremely well, and it seemed to me that your comfort with your narrative voice increased as the story progressed; by the end of the story, you had developed a very deft touch for where to come forward and where to step back.
I'm eager to read the Talljet Quartet now, though after the way ATR sucked me in I think I'll have to postpone starting it until I know I'll have the time to devote to it. And until ATR has had a chance to settle into my brain; I know that I'll be thinking about this story for a long time. This is a most impressive accomplishment, Karmen, and a damned good read.
Ellen
thaet mon eathe tosliteththaette naefre gesomnad waes
***
>From: Karmen Ghia karmen_ghia@yahoo.com >Dear Ellen,
>
>Today is my 41st birthday and this feedback is the >I'll send more detailed thanks to the list tomorrow ===== Karmen Ghia - After The Rescue http://members.tripod.com/karmen_ghia/ http://oocities.com/Paris/Villa/4422/ END of FEEDBACK Revised: May 27, 2002
>To: Ellen Fremedon
>Subject: Re: FB: ATR, part 2
>Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 21:19:47 -0700 (PDT)
>
>nicest present I've gotten in years. Thank you.
>
>when I've had some rest, but I wanted to thank you
>personally for being the kind of reader every writer
>in the universe prays for.